View Full Version : Call Me Stupid

12-05-2006, 07:29 PM
kinda confused. i was reading a thread on headers and emissions and yada yada. how does a header differ from the one thats on the stock zuki? i thought they were all "headers". like i said call me stupid. i was leaning towards the doug thorley just out of "because". not knowing any difference between joe blow header and dougs header????? i just want to replace my raggedy, rusty, cracking P.O.S. stocker with something that is both fuctional and legal. please advise my retarded arse....bigok bigok bigok

12-05-2006, 07:46 PM
well I am not too sure about the emissions part that would depend on your local laws. for that all you will have to do is check with the manufacturer if they are legal.
the difference in the headers and your stock manifold is flow, or more over improving the flow. the tubes are much longer on a header into a larger colector to help scavenge exhaust gasses. the collector uses the pulses from other cylinders to help "pull" spent gasses out of the engine.
the Thorley header uses this design even further and does a 4 into 2 into one design. I used a regular Heddman header as it was available to me at a good price and I could get it in a regulat painted finish. I put my own ceramic coating on it at work. since I work in the aerospace industry I figured why pay for something when I can apply it myself.
I would highly recomend getting a ceramic coated header, it extends their live and it does help in reducing under hood temps.

hope this helps

12-05-2006, 07:55 PM
thanks a bunch northern most zuker! that helps a bunch. im not loooking into racing anyone or winning bling bling contests. i want functiona and maybe some performance if that happens.. again thanks

12-05-2006, 07:55 PM
Most headers out there are emis. legal just needs a place for o2 sensor.:happy Tri-y=best low end torque,4 into 1= best top end hp. doesnt matter if its a 1.3 or5.7cld.Just depends on were you want the power.Remember though a 1.3 and 1.6 dont make power below 3500rpm.So does a high torque header help on these small engs. good ?

12-05-2006, 08:09 PM
you are welcome!!
it's not really about racing or all out power, thou a little more would be nice for any zuk!! lol
it's more about improving the efficiency of the engine. helping an engine to breathe better will improve power and mileage. :dance:
the coating is great though it does cost a little more unless you go for stainless. the heating and cooling of the manifold will have it rusty and ugly in no time at all. I just figure if you are going to spend some money might as well get something that will last a long time. just my .02 rockonn

12-05-2006, 08:22 PM
Most headers out there are emis. legal just needs a place for o2 sensor.:happy Tri-y=best low end torque,4 into 1= best top end hp. doesnt matter if its a 1.3 or5.7cld.Just depends on were you want the power.Remember though a 1.3 and 1.6 dont make power below 3500rpm.So does a high torque header help on these small engs. good ?

I noticed a big difference idleing up obstacles in my 1.6 when I added the Thorely, it's a trail zook so I wasn't looking for highway speeds. I am hoping the Pacesetter (4to1 - looong tubes) will help the DD on the highway. We shall see over Christmas break...

12-05-2006, 08:23 PM
I got the Calmini header. It is coated and still looks good. Remember that you will probably have to redo most of the exhaust or atleast redo the part that ties into the header cause they will not match up.

12-05-2006, 10:05 PM
Headers claim more of a power increase than can be delivered but it is all about the flow. Faster revving with longer powerband is almost always noticed by header owners. So go for it. You can verify the performance by clocking your times at fixed rpms uphill before and after the install. That way when you do the calculations and find out you have a 1% power increase x the mileage drop you will have to drive 500,000 miles to pay for the header. I am not being a smart ass I just want you to know that a header does help the 1.3 but it doesn't make it into a stroker motor. I run one with cam and 2" exhaust. However, the factory spent millions designing that "stock exhaust manifold" to deliver optimum performance. Because your exhaust manifold is cracked it no longer offers the optimum performance, in fact it is detrimental to your engine.

12-05-2006, 10:47 PM
I have been reading the thread here guys, and I have looked at the header for my sword when I do the My-Fi FI system. Just how much fun to get these rusted exhaust manifold bolts out??? They look to me that everyone of them will be something that will twist off in the manifold, leaving me to bust the manifold off the head and hopefully not break the head???

What have you guys ran into removing the exhaust manifolds on these little 1.3L motors???

12-05-2006, 11:00 PM
Mine was not bad at all. i thought like you and was prepaired to break out the torch. lol

I just soaked the bolts down in PB Blaster and they came off with ease.

12-06-2006, 09:14 AM
Well, that makes me feel a little better about that I guess. They sure don't appear that way LOL. I have never had any break off in the exhaust manifold before on any vehicle I owned, but I have had to help those that did LOL...

I am not really quite ready for the big change to the My-Fi just yet anyway, money still in the darned way around here and all. Get the holidays and all the unexpected's it always brings on out of the way and maybe I can get more focused on just that.

I just have this fear about the aluminum head I think I see under the valve cover LOL... I really have cleaned up the motor, tranny, axles and transfer case on this sword and been looking everything all over pretty close and the only thing I really hate about this thing is the carb system and the gear ratio this thing has. The little monster was pretty darn clean and was way low mileage when I bought her, just had a leaky valve cover and a few bummed things on her.

The damned carb has to go and was about to buy a webber when I ran into Myron's My-Fi system and web site to see a much better way... I do think that will more than fix those issues and since the colder weather has moved in the carb really has been a problem:) The header idea is something I figure I could livce without easy enough, but figure it would help also if I wanted to pry the exhaust manifold off and replace all that mess too. Gear ratio and the wimpy tires that are on her is another zip code that I will address later also as that will bump the $$$ problems that are always a problem around hereLOL...

12-06-2006, 11:14 AM
Wow! Lots Of Great Info Again. I Was Actually Leaning Towards A Whole Front To Back System. Mine Has Been Cut And Pasted Together From Cat Back And Is More Of A Problem Than Its Worth. Along With That I Also Want To Rebuild The Little Beast In Feb. Its Just Every Mornin I Start The Booger The Cab Gets Way Too Much Exhaust Inside While Sitting At Idle. Not To Happy With Co2 Being That Abundant In The Cab,,...... Thats Why I Figured Id Go And Yank The Exhaust From Header Back And Do It Right... Thanks Again Guys!

12-06-2006, 11:36 AM
If you want a header, then the easiest thing (less headaches) is just buy a good header and take it to the local muffler shop and tell them you want it installed with a new exhaust system. Let them deal with the bends and call it good. If you can work with the stock manifold, them get a complete system from Brent at Trail Tough. It bolts in in an hour in the driveway.
Been there, Done both...

12-06-2006, 04:48 PM
:bling: This is my 1.6 16 valve Doug Thorley Header


12-06-2006, 04:52 PM
oooooooooooooooooooh shiney, i like shiney.

i have the calmini header on my 16v and apart from it not fitting ( the holes didn't line up with the studs) it works and looks nice.

built my own exhaust system using the calmini sports mufler, turned it into a side exit system.
sounds nice and has improved performance.

12-09-2006, 11:07 AM
It has a Number stamped on the pipe for ur emitions and it has a place for the O2 cencor.

12-27-2006, 02:43 AM
The tubes on headers are tuned for a desired outcome, just like organ pipes. Different lengths and different bores (inside diameters) result in different horsepower/torque curves.

Equal length tubes even out the back pressure for each cylinder. This is why some headers have screwy shapes. It's not for looks. The tri-Y design evens out the back pressure for a given firing order; especially important for shorter tubes.

Short and/or fat header tubes provide increased HP at higher RPMs. However, taken to it's extreme, the HP peak will fall outside of the specs for the engine. That's why a little bit of back pressure is a good thing. It does you no good if your Zuk's HP peaks at 8K. If your objective is to maximize your HP at highway speeds, short and fat is for you.

Long and/or smaller bore header tubes produce increased torque at lower RPMs. If your objective is to gain power for crawling over rocks, long and thin is for you.

http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles/116_0312_test/index.html (page 1)
http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles/116_0312_test/index1.html (page 2)
http://superchevy.com/technical/engines_drivetrain/exhaust/0504sc_header/index.html (page 1)
http://superchevy.com/technical/engines_drivetrain/exhaust/0504sc_header/index1.html (page 2)

01-15-2007, 11:08 PM
For the Suzuki Samurai, Tracker/Sidekick there is only 1 header on the market that is 50 state emission legal. Doug Thorley. The EO number plate and the O2 bung are what gives it that.

As for power, dont expect much. A larger exhaust is nothing more then a placibo to seat of the pants feel. Air in, Fuel in, fire, and bad air out makes seat of the pants difference. A decent carb and a good exhaust are the best thing you can get.

The new headers do serve a purpose in that they are cheaper to replace and install then a new OEM manifold. The OEM ones do crack, if it hasnt already. The header will most likely not.

The Ceramic coating adds a couple hunder bucks to the Thorley.